the wrong end of the telescope

That's a really good way of putting it. I always get so flustered in those conversations because I just don't get why they don't get it. Or intellectually I do, I guess, and I know I've been in the wrong before, but there's only so many times you can have those conversations when there's no guarantee you're going to get through at all. It is nice when you do, though still so exhausting.