on policing women's bodies

[harborshore]

I debated filtering or friendslocking this, because it involves a conversation about body hair, but fuck it, it's important.

Today I was told I may have hormonal issues--or rather, that I may have more male hormones than is usual. Note the 'may have'.



So I went to a doctor because of breast and lymph node pain. He checked on that. The good news is that I don't appear to have cancer. But then he proceeded to tell me that since I have some unusual hair growth (read: some hair under my chin I haven't gotten around to plucking and a few stray hairs on my boobs--and I don't shave my armpits) he thinks I may have some extra testosterone floating around which may be causing the pain problems as well. This doctor isn't an endocrinologist or a gynecologist, but he THINKS it may all go away if I go on birth control. I mean. Dude. He didn't even base this on blood tests that showed unusual levels of testosterone or anything.

And I just. What. My mother has hairs on her chin. My sister does as well, and she has hairs on her boobs, same as I do. (She, by the way, also happens to be one of the most conventionally attractive women I know, and none of her string of boyfriends have minded that she has them.) But it's a sign of hormonal problems? I mean, first of all, HOW do we define a problem? I don't think that's a fucking problem, I think my breast pain and my period cramps and my other kinds of pain are a problem. I now have a referral for hair growth. I mean what. I took it because he said he'd put in a note that they hurry it up (it's to a place I already have a referral to, for the other kinds of pain), but I still can't believe it happened.

So, this is what happened: a few stray hairs on my boobs were startling enough that this dude thought I should be referred to a doctor. I came to him for pain. I'm so angry I could--women have hair too. WOMEN HAVE BODY HAIR.

Comments

[extemporally.livejournal.com]

ARGH >:(

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

IN A NUTSHELL. God, I hate everything right now.

[extemporally.livejournal.com]

also like - i KNOW shaving is a personal choice, and even if the imperative to shave is a loaded choice, that is at least a choice. but by portraying body hair as medically pertinent - that's just BAD DIAGNOSIS and policing that's presented as compulsory, you know? fuck. :(((

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

Yes, exactly! I just. WHAT THE FUCK. I'm too angry to be intelligent about it, but the level of policing this implies--how you SHOULD look--my god.

[extemporally.livejournal.com]

how you should look to not 'look good', whatever that means, but to 'be healthy'.

I know neither of us are medical experts but a few chin hairs = YOUR HORMONAL LEVELS ARE OUT OF WHACK is just like the worst thinking. >:(

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

Ahahaha yes. (I also had hormonal tests done two years ago and, uh, nothing like what he suggested showed up.) It's like--women have body hair, you know? The presence of them doesn't indicate an imbalance of anything. I sincerely hope he doesn't have, say, Middle Eastern patients or anyone who is trans or anything like that. Or rather, I wish he had no patients. Bodyshaming is not a thing a doctor should do.

[eledhwenlin]

... what. O_O

Dude, I AM on birth control and I, too, have hair under my chin and on my boobs. It's just really fucking normal.

*hugs* I hope that the other doctors will be better than he was.

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

No fucking kidding. And the doctor I have the referral to will be better, she's amazing.

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

Right? Right. Thanks, doc, you made me feel real good about myself.

[ciel-vert.livejournal.com]

Ugh. Stupid doctor. >:(

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

Blargh, I'm so mad.

[anoneknewmoose.livejournal.com]

wowwwwwwwww FUCK YOU DOCTOR

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

Yup.

[mahoni.livejournal.com]

...well, but it really *might* be an indication that you have a little more testosterone going on than what is considered 'normal' (which, who knows why the bar for 'normal' was set where it was, but that's another issue). Despite being pretty damn feminine, I have upper lip fuzz that I wax (ow, but having a 'stache, even a very faint one, weirds me out :P), a chin hair, and a few stray hairs on my boobs, and the poking around I've done online and the questions I've asked my doctor (out of curiosity) indicates it may have to do with having a bit of a higher testosterone level as I get older. And now that you've made this post I'm wondering if my ever-present breast tenderness could be part of that. It's something I might bring up with my gynecologist next time I see her, anyway. Thanks for the heads up! :D

But yeah, all I'm saying is that it seems surprising that he'd jump to that conclusion based on just a couple of stray hairs, but it's not a totally off the wall idea as far as I know...

(Which, incidentally, if I DO have more testosterone than what is considered normal, I'm not bothered by it. Neither was my doctor - he considered it a pretty commonplace thing for women. The only thing that would bother me is if I turn out to have a receding hairline/thinning hair due to testosterone levels. Then I may be all OMG GIVE ME ESTROGEN. OR SOMETHING. PLEASE. I like having hair.)

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

No, I know it's not an off-the-wall idea in terms of the fact that increased body hair growth can be an indication of an increase in testosterone, but, uh, if every single woman in my family has the same "problem" and if the hair growth in no way started at the same time as the pain, then either we all have always had higher levels of testosterone than normal or there's something else going on here. And I'm 27 and my sister's 24, and the body hair is not a new thing, so it's not like it's something that has changed with age either (unless you count the actual appearance of it for the first time).

Also, I had hormonal testing done the first time I sought help for the cramps, at which point I had the same amount of body hair, so I actually know it's not what he's suggesting.

[mahoni.livejournal.com]

Did you tell him you'd had hormonal testing done? (I'm just curious what he said if you did. :)

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

I didn't tell him, no. I honestly didn't even remember it at the time, I was really thrown by everything about the whole experience.

And also he was offering me a potential diagnosis that he flat-out told me wasn't within his level of expertise and he was basing it on five minutes of interaction with me and two minutes of seeing me without a shirt? Like, I trust that if there had been signs of cancer, dude would have seen it, because breasts are what he does.

I just wanted a confirmation that it wasn't cancer. That's why I was referred to him by another doctor, who was fairly sure it wasn't, but wanted to make sure. Mastalgia--pain in breasts--especially pain that follows the menstrual cycle, is really common among women (2 out of 3 have it), and it's usually caused by a slightly lowered level of progesterone. Which I do have. There's no real treatment for it. But that would have been a slightly more sensible conclusion, no? Because I did tell him that part.

[hammerhead22.livejournal.com]

I hear you! Back before they diagnosed me with PMDD, I went through a shit ton of testing including hormones, thyroid, etc. to determine what was happening with my body. One doctor was completely stuck on a diagnosis of polycystic ovaries because of my body hair, even though I don't in any way have polycystic ovaries. Ugh. This stupid, unattainable American beauty ideal infects even our doctors.

Between the doctors and American social norms, I'm rather ticked off about the whole body hair issue. Due to my heritage, an not my completely normal hormones/ovaries/etc., I have body hair. I have my brows and most of my face down to my neck waxed every three weeks, I have boob hair, I have a happy trail, and my legs get five o'clock shadow at about 3:00pm every day. Deal with it world. There is nothing wrong with me except people not being able to fucking deal with a little body hair.

Hurumph.

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

RIGHT. I so wish I would have had a woman, because at least she would have presumedly known that women have body hair and not gotten stuck on that. Though women doctors can be silly too, of course.

That must have been such a frustrating experience for you, argh. I'm glad you got the right diagnosis at last. And the world can just buck up and deal, I agree.

[crowgirl13.livejournal.com]

Best watch out for your scary, unruly masculine HAIRS.

Ooogy Boooogy!

[For fuck's sake, where did he get his degree? A cereal box?]

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

HAHAHA yes. Exactly.

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

It was almost funny (in the way where it wasn't) because I truly hadn't--my body hair is not on the list of what I consider a problem, you know? And so when he started talking about that, looking a little embarrassed, too, I just stared at him super confusedly because I had no idea what the hell he was talking about.

And yeah, exactly--you'd noted a CHANGE. I'm just genetically blessed, here. Ha.

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

I mean--I truly don't have a lot of body hair. Not that it would matter to this story if I did, because it's FINE, women have body hair, but if he reacts like this to me? I don't even know.

...wow. That is a special degree of special. WOW.

[desfinado.livejournal.com]

WOMAN HAVE BODY HAIR. WHAT THE FUCK. He didn't even do a blood test. O___________O Not okay >:(

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

I just--the LEVEL of body policing, that a lack of body hair doesn't just signify attractive but also healthy? ARGH. And yes, exactly. No blood test, no asking me if the body hair constituted a change, nothing.

[elucreh.livejournal.com]

My god, it's like the art critic from the fifteen hundred LIVE AND WITH A MEDICAL LICENSE, wtf

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

I don't actually know that reference, but I am sure it is absolutely relevant :D

[ignipes.livejournal.com]

What the fuck. If having unseemly body hair is a medical condition, I should probably be in the ICU. OH NOES. MEDICAL EMERGENCY. Or, you know. Genetics and stuff.

I hope you can find somebody to help you pinpoint the source of the pain without diverting the attention to other things, and without presenting solutions without first verifying the source of the problem. *hugs*

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

GENETICS. Right. Do they teach that in medical school, do you think? Ahahaha.

That would indeed be very nice. The doctor I've been referred to (the old referral for pain) is by all accounts amazing and specializes in exactly this kind of thing, so I have hope. *hugs back* ♥

[x_dark_siren_x]

DUDE. >:( I mean, I'm "lucky", most of my body hair is blonde, except where it isn't or where I do shave. I have blonde hair on my boobs and what people would probably call a "fuzz" around my mouth (though I do get some dark hairs there, occasionally, but not enough that I notice them unless I'm up close at a mirror to do my eyebrows), and what's dark is very, very dark, and no one has ever suggested it was a "problem", or an indication of one. Not even when I was being tested for PCOS! >:( Guy needs some cognitive recalibration, if you ask me. Maybe you could write to the surgery, or even to him, and say how unhappy you were with such a diagnosis being made, when he made it on such little, stupid evidence, and - as you say - it wasn't even his field!

I'll be over here, raging on your behalf. *fumes*

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

I may do that when I've gotten my actual diagnosis, yeah. Fuck.

[sinuous-curve.livejournal.com]

brb punching that doctor in the nose.

*hugs you very fiercely*

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

I just. Jesus Christ. HOW fucked up about women's bodies is our society? HOW. (This is also coming on the heels on a hairdresser last week telling me the style I was asking for wasn't feminine enough. WOOT.)

*clings*

[morebliss.livejournal.com]

What a prick. I hope all his hair starts growing out of his nose.

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

I wish I could sic Audrey on him. *admires your icon* Or Leslie Knope, that'd be glorious.

[sunsetmog.livejournal.com]

I am SO SORRY you had to go through that insensitive shit from someone who should have known better. FFS, women have BODY HAIR and they don't look like the women on baywatch without a fuck ton of plucking and shaving and waxing. >:(

[harborshore.livejournal.com]

Right? For fucking serious. WOMEN HAVE BODY HAIR. ARGH. It was so maddening, it took me all day to come down from the initial rage.

[mrsquizzical.livejournal.com]

WTF. >:(

[cloudlessclimes.livejournal.com]

ugh that sucks. i am so very lucky that all my doctors are so awesome. i got sent to a horrible specialist once and he made me feel stupid and like i inconvenienced him. when i went back for follow up with my gp he was so angry he called the specialist and bitched him out. <3 which is too say, i'm so sorry that happened to you and i hope the doctor you got a referral for is great. also hurray for no cancer!